Pagan Coffee Talk
We will discuss topics related to the Pagan community. All views are from a traditionalist's point of view. The conversations are unscripted (no preparations have been made ahead of time). A special thanks to Darkest Era for the use of their songs: Intro- The Morrigan, Exit - Poem to the Gael. Check them out at http://darkestera.net/.
Pagan Coffee Talk
Sam-taines
The episode highlights the seasonal influx of interest in pagan rituals, particularly around Samhain and Beltane. It discusses the balance between accommodating newcomers and maintaining the integrity of established practices, addressing the logistical challenges for clergy during peak times.
• Discussion on the surge of seekers during high pagan holidays
• Comparison of seasonal attendance in Christianity and Paganism
• The importance of open versus closed circles in ritual settings
• Challenges of managing newcomers during significant festivals
• Emphasis on logistics, preparation, and community delegation
• Understanding the energetics of rituals and their impacts
• Suggestions for developing relationships with open circle groups
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Welcome to Pagan Coffee Talk. If you enjoy our content, please consider donating and following our socials. Now here are your hosts, lady Abba and Lord Knight.
Speaker 3:So we are. You know, samhain has recently passed, we are at the beginning of the new, the pagan new year. Yule is upon us and every year, temple goes through a period in typically, right, it starts right about the beginning of October, right, and it goes through Samhain, where we have this influx of interest yes, potential students, people wanting to come to rituals, right, it's. Yeah. Yeah, we get more requests for house blessings. Yes, potential students, people wanting to come to rituals.
Speaker 4:right, it's yeah. Yeah, we get more requests for house blessings.
Speaker 3:Yes, and it's always really funny. So we've all heard the term keister, right, the Christians who only go to church twice a year, right Easter and Christmas.
Speaker 4:Christmas.
Speaker 3:So I have decided that we have the Sautains, the people who pop up every year. Right, it's Samhain and Beltane and they want somewhere to go, somewhere to be, and it's kind of I get it. I get why it happens.
Speaker 4:I'm not shaming these people, but it is funny.
Speaker 3:No, but we have two things that have to happen. One, if you're clergy, you have to be prepared for it Now. On one hand, it's very tempting to be very motivated by this and suddenly go, oh my gosh, we have all this new interest. This is amazing, and you kind of rush into action. Don't do it. Don't do it Because the problem is many of these folks it is somewhat fly by night.
Speaker 3:They're not going to last, they're not going to stick around and you already have enough on your plate in preparation for Samhain or Beltane, whichever one's going on so often. What we do is right in that month of October we defer, yeah, we tell people we would love to meet with you, but we're in one of our high, holy time. We're going to have to meet with you after. That's a good indication of who's going to stick around right there. That is a really really kind of important little piece to this is can you, can you push them a little bit? Can you push them off? And they're all right with it. And the other is you know you'll, you'll end up you'll bend over backwards and you'll drive yourself crazy trying to accommodate all of this, and it does become way too much. But folks have to understand that if you're contacting a coven, a temple, a pagan church at one of these times of year and expecting that you're just going to be open-armed and welcomed in, that is not always going to be the case.
Speaker 4:I mean especially with these two. The majority of the times, especially in traditional, these two rituals are normally closed to almost everybody, except for Exactly Initiates, and that really is the difference.
Speaker 3:Are you, have you approached an open circle or a closed circle? Right, and that's what you have to know Now. Open circle is exactly what it sounds like. Yes, they will welcome you in for that celebration, and usually they're going to do it outside. It's going to be at a public park. It's going to be somewhere you know that can hold a large number of people to. It's going to be a slightly generic ritual. I don't mean that is a bad thing.
Speaker 2:It's just going to be generic standard, right there's.
Speaker 3:There's not going to be anything to it. It's going to mirror any other type of church service, right in structure, in purpose, in order. It's going to have a very familiar sort of feel if you've ever been to any other church, a closed group. However, we have business, we have things that need to happen, we have specific rights that are being performed.
Speaker 4:We have specific ways, oh boy.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we are not simply going to welcome in anybody, and especially those we do not know. At these very important times that could really. First of all, it can throw off your circle big time. Second of all, it takes your attention away. I am the first to say the last thing. The last thing that I want to have to deal with as a priestess on a high holy holiday is noobs.
Speaker 4:Doing the following. So why did y'all do it that way?
Speaker 3:Why did y'all go in that direction or anything, just having to be concerned about them. Because that's the problem, right? Newbies, new people, we are aware of them constantly. We have to look out for them, we have to answer questions, their comfort, their safety, right, all of these things as well as our own, but it's a lot.
Speaker 4:It's a lot and I don't want my focus distracted or divided by that, and at no time as a priest do I ever want to sit there and force and have to force a first degree or a second degree to babysit somebody so they don't get to enjoy it.
Speaker 3:Exactly, exactly. That's a lot of responsibility, so you have to make these things clear. If you're running a group, you really really have to make these things clear. If you're running a group, you really really have to make these things clear about where you stand on the grands and are you open to, or is it open circle or is it closed, and make that public facing knowledge within your organization, because otherwise, yeah, yeah, the soutanes are going to show up in force, yeah, and it can get sticky.
Speaker 3:And then you know, the other thing that we see a lot is families, because, of course, if you've got a parent who's a pagan and they want to go to a service, they're bringing everybody right, the whole lot's coming, which is fine. Again, there's nothing wrong with that. But do you allow children in your circle, exactly right? Um, do you, is it? I mean, do you again, do you have somebody in place to babysit said children? If necessary? Then you have additional mouths to feed you have. There's so much that goes into that process. It's a difficult time of year to try to navigate.
Speaker 4:I mean, I've seen you through this multiple times. You're you're, you're stressed for about a month and you know, I know, I'm constantly calling you up and texting you. Okay, yeah, you need anything. What can I do? You need me to come over.
Speaker 3:You ain't said nothing well, because it comes down to the hosting right, the hosting, the hosting party. So we have ritual at my house which means look, my friends, my family, they know it. From October 1st to November 1st, don't talk to me. Whatever it is, it has to wait. Don't call me up. Do you want to go do this thing? No. Do you want to come to this fall fest? No. Do you have time to come help me? No, do you want to come to this fall fest?
Speaker 4:No, do you have time to come help me. No, I can help you out. If it exceeds anything, hey, I need to drop this off to you.
Speaker 3:Forget it. Yeah, no, it's a big old no, because we are between food preparation and management, right. Preparation and management, right. Okay, the homestead itself, indoors, outdoors, the cleaning, the preparation, getting it ready for guests. Linens make, I mean you, you are a maid to your own home for a good two weeks, um, if you have animals making arrangements there and figuring out what has to happen and how it's going to happen. Parking, you know any any like? Look for us, right, because we we get a pretty significant fall here in North Carolina, right, my, the exterior of my property leaves and limbs and trimming and cutting, and you know these things have to happen as well and I'm not going to have people show up and the property is a mess I mean because I hate to be this way.
Speaker 4:If you don't realize this, them leads get slip yeah, exactly, exactly.
Speaker 3:It's safety, precaution type things too. Then we get into um ritual, the ritual organization, making sure that we have all the supplies that we need. I mean, it is a lot of stuff and usually, again, because it's a major like you know Zao and Beltane we have additional preparation beyond that. Is there an activity or a special thing that we're doing that we need to plan and prep for? I mean so delegation is critical. Yes, delegation is huge. Right, having people in place throughout the organization that have specific tasks in relation to the event. Huge and essential. But, again, it's got to be people who've been around long enough to at least have seen a Samhain prior and understand what's going to take place and what's necessary.
Speaker 4:Now, how do we again, if this is what these people I'm not going to interrupt them, but how do we prevent this? How do we stop and get these people to come more? I mean, because there's a toss up here, because I don't want to interrupt their growth.
Speaker 3:Look, it's hard, it's not easy, I can say for me, when I was a solitary I guess if you want to call it that I had found a group. I remember going through it where every year it would be like a little hurt in my heart, like a little longing around that time of year. It's because it really is like right. The modern joke is, you know, girls love fall right. A leaf falls in Connecticut and collectively, every woman in the country pops her head up and realizes it's boots, uggs and pumpkin spice season, you know, and we all just lose our minds and that's adorable.
Speaker 3:But for pagans it's even more than that. We have a moment of. The veil is thin, it hits us and it and, and the yes, the, the decorations and the goings on, it doesn't help it. We feel like something is missing, right. So any intimidation that we might've felt, any fear, any apprehension, any I don't know, just barriers that you know, nervousness that we might have to reaching out to a group, are likely to lessen because of that pull, because we want to find somewhere to go and someone to connect with.
Speaker 3:But yeah, it's just the wrong time. Um, and we do. We see it again. We see it in the springtime, it's the same. Those are the biggies, those are the two big turning points for most of us, where it's the most palpable. I don't think we do prevent it, I think we just have to be prepared for it. Yeah, we just have to know that it's going to happen and it is really well and truly talking to people about their expectations when they reach out, and I think it's about having alternate resources. Now, that, to me, is the big thing, right, like if somebody contacts us on October 5th and is like I'd like to come meet with you guys and come to Samhain.
Speaker 3:I'm sorry. Unfortunately we are closed to guests at Samhain, but here is a group in the area that has an open circle, right, if you would like to attend a ritual, you can do theirs. But then, please, we can set up a meeting after that and discuss whatever.
Speaker 4:There's also a part of this that you also got to understand. We have to be acutely aware of what happens to people after ritual. There are a lot of energies and stuff and I see energy sometimes and if you've not been in ritual for a long, period of time it can kind of or ever or ever it can kind of, which is another reason we tend to especially on these heavy rituals, because we're using a lot of power, I guess, or energies. There's a lot.
Speaker 3:There's so many things taking place, there's so much in the air, literally right, and I have seen people become incredibly inebriated after a ritual off of just a little bit of alcohol. I've seen people become giddy to a point of annoyance where you just want them to stop it. I have seen people become lethargic and almost falling asleep, kind of you know want, yeah, it affects everyone. You know, yeah, it affects everyone differently.
Speaker 4:Now I got to ask do you think ritual space is kind of like doing drugs? Because we're in there we build up a tolerance.
Speaker 3:It can be, we build. No, to me it's different. So for clergy it's not a tolerance, we don't have a choice. True, we have to learn. So, okay, this is, this is how I view it. When you are in ritual space and you are able to just be in it and just sort of flow and rock back and forth and let it kind of run through you and around you and when you learn to flow with it when you learn to flow with it you're fine when you are in any way fighting it or acutely aware of it, or trying to hold on to
Speaker 4:it, you become a blithering idiot you cannot hold on to this energy. It's not yours.
Speaker 3:No, it's not yours, it was never meant to be yours. And that's the problem it becomes. We have to sort of give ourselves. We have to give into it yes, we give into it to learn how to work with it and in it.
Speaker 4:You surrender to it to master it. I know that sounds very.
Speaker 3:A lot of the things that happen. We end up and this is, you know, the further along you are, the harder this becomes right. We always say the longer you've been, let's say like a third degree, it's harder to think back to when you weren't Right and we become jaded. So for us it becomes frustrating. Where you know, for instance, circle, circle casting, I see first degrees or second degrees make mistakes and I'm like you. Just you have to pay more attention to what's happening inside of circle when other people are casting, so you can see what should be taking place and you realize they can't.
Speaker 3:Yet right they're trying, they're trying, but they can't. They're just, it's not. They don't have that ability yet.
Speaker 4:They haven't learned how to fully work with it and I think you're right and I do think this is a problem on us spiritually. We tend to forget yeah, I mean, first degree was a long time for me, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, it's kind of inevitable too. I mean, how can we not forget, in a way, like we're, yeah, I don't know. It definitely definitely becomes an interesting situation that we have to be aware of. But for beginners it's just a lot to deal with, and I mean even the aftermath of questions. I cannot imagine having somebody have a sauerin be their first ritual no, and then immediately after we have a flurry of activity and of course they have questions and things they want and I'm like, oh, yeah, yeah, no, it's too much.
Speaker 4:It's too much you know, it's one thing to sit there and answer questions about a full moon, but something like do you know how many times I would sit there and go? That's a mystery. That's a mystery. No, I can't talk about that.
Speaker 3:Yep, yep, yep.
Speaker 4:And there are again.
Speaker 3:There are exceptions to things that we normally do, the normal rhythm of things at Grands, and those exceptions will cause even more confusion. Yeah, so just you know, know that they're out there, the soutanes are. You know, like I said, it's inevitable. It's not a bad thing, but you have to be prepared. I think in some cases, depending on the size of a group, it is even wise to you know, come late August, early September, go okay. So this year we need to volunteer to answer questions and to field the phone calls from the people who are inevitably going to reach out or email, and that is something a first degree could do.
Speaker 3:That's a great task for a first degree to say, hey, I need you to contact these folks, talk to them, set up a meeting for after that one.
Speaker 4:Yeah, there's nothing wrong with it, I just want you to say the word one more time. They're what Soutains.
Speaker 3:Soutains we don't have, because it's either that or it's bellhains.
Speaker 3:No, no, no, no, I don't know, no, or bellweens Bellweens, it doesn't sound as good. No, but there's a little bit of preparation in that. But it's understanding. We just we don't have the same resources for it. I mean, I think it's lovely, you know, when churches can accommodate that interest. It's also a big time of money making for them. I mean, donations are higher, you have more people coming in and offering cash and I mean all of those things are wonderful, but we just don't have that, we don't have the resources for that in most cases. So again, this is where it does behoove you to make a decent relationship with whomever in the pagan community is doing the open ritual.
Speaker 4:Yes.
Speaker 3:Ideally, ideally, what would be wonderful, very difficult in some cases, but I mean, it would be lovely to have a situation where, you know and I would love to do it here in our area I don't know how feasible it is, but if you have four or five groups, it rotates and every year you have one hosting group that's doing the open circle for the entire community and then everyone else does their you know, individual things. I think that that would be a phenomenal idea for the traditionals to get together and sort of do that for one another and to to again bolster community relations. But that's something that's always been a challenge for us and you know we're getting a little better at it, but but it takes time, yep.
Speaker 1:More coffee, my Lord, more coffee. Okay, thanks for listening. Join us next week for another episode. Pagan Coffee Talk is brought to you by Life Temple and Seminary. Please visit us at lifetempelseminaryorg for more information, as well as links to our social media Facebook, discord, twitter of stone and mire.
Speaker 2:Just hold my hand as we pass by a sea of blazing fires, and so it is the end of our day so walk with me till morning breaks. And so it is the end of our day. So walk with me Till morning.
