Pagan Coffee Talk
We will discuss topics related to the Pagan community. All views are from a traditionalist's point of view. The conversations are unscripted (no preparations have been made ahead of time). A special thanks to Darkest Era for the use of their songs: Intro- The Morrigan, Exit - Poem to the Gael. Check them out at http://darkestera.net/.
Pagan Coffee Talk
Beyond the Band-Aid: The Truth About Magical Healing Work
Magical healing carries profound responsibility and potential dangers that many practitioners overlook. When we suppress symptoms without addressing root causes, we risk masking serious conditions—as illustrated by our cautionary tale of healing spells that concealed diabetes symptoms until crisis struck. The fundamental rule? Always obtain proper medical diagnosis before attempting healing work.
The energy exchange in healing deserves careful consideration. Many practitioners use crystals to contain negative energies extracted during healing, but these objects become repositories of harmful forces that can leak back into your environment over time. This explains why many dedicated healers find themselves chronically ill. We discuss practical solutions: proper containment vessels, cleansing practices, and most importantly, removing these contaminated objects from your living space.
Our conversation explores a rarely discussed aspect of magical healing—what might be called "spiritual hospice care." Sometimes, the most compassionate healing involves helping someone transition peacefully rather than prolonging suffering. Like hospice nurses who provide comfort during end-of-life care, some magical practitioners must develop the strength and wisdom to guide others through their final journey.
The podcast features a fascinating philosophical debate about the nature of healing energy itself. Are healers sacrificing portions of their own life force to heal others? Or are we simply channeling universal energy that naturally replenishes through our connection to cosmic forces? This fundamental difference in understanding shapes how practitioners approach their work and subsequent self-care.
We note the particular aptitude many women demonstrate for healing magic—likely connected to natural nurturing instincts, though certainly not excluding men from developing these abilities.
Visit lifetempleseminary.org to support our work and connect with us on social media. Join us next week as we continue exploring the depths of magical practice with practical wisdom for the modern practitioner.
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Welcome to Pagan Coffee Talk. If you enjoy our content, please consider donating and following our socials. So we had a suggestion as much as you hear our dog, we should introduce him. Everybody say hey to Baller.
Speaker 2:Hi Baller.
Speaker 1:You'll hear him off and on in the background. It's okay, we're also drying some herbs, so you'll probably hear that in the background as well, anyway.
Speaker 2:Yes, I'm being productive today. Right, let's talk healing spells. Okay, this is a subject we need to cover anyway, because healing spells can be sometimes can be a little dangerous. I will agree with you on that. When performing a healing spell, first thing you need to know is what's wrong with the person Right? What's the diagnosis, what's the diagnosis? And the diagnosis isn't a list of symptoms.
Speaker 1:No, that's not. You're not looking for symptoms, you're not looking for anything like that.
Speaker 2:I would even sit here and suggest try not to cure symptoms right.
Speaker 1:I think that kind of defeats the purpose of what you're doing right, I mean.
Speaker 2:so let's let me give you an example of where in the world healing symptoms went horribly wrong. Yes, let let's do All, right, a friend of Lord man back in the day kept on having different symptoms and stuff like this, so they kept on doing healing spells for the guy. You remember him telling this story.
Speaker 2:Very vividly yeah it was like over a month, over a couple of years or something. This guy kept on having different symptoms and they would do healing spells and move on. Well, one day the guy just suddenly falls out on the floor of going into a diabetic coma, right, because he didn't have any of the symptoms of being a diabetic, because they healed him off, so it wasn't being treated, so it wasn't being treated, so it wasn't being treated. And then causes a bigger problem.
Speaker 1:Okay, but now question comes, and I'm sure somebody's going to ask this If you're healing the symptoms, how are you not, in essence, treating the root problem?
Speaker 2:Well, diabetes is a biological problem I don't think any magic will fix. I mean, there's just certain things I don't think magic can fix.
Speaker 1:But you see the question though, right. How are you healing symptoms without touching the problem? How?
Speaker 2:can you do that? Well, I believe that most of these magic spells are just suppressing the symptoms. See, that's where I'm getting at All right, they're not actually getting rid of them, they're just suppressing the symptoms or causing the symptoms not to appear.
Speaker 1:Right or somehow Right. So that's where the danger is.
Speaker 2:That's where the danger is If you're not really healing anything, you're just suppressing. When we're doing a healing without a diagnosis, we run into problems. Yep, all right, there's the trick on this you have to have a diagnosis Right, and I don't mean just going out on WebMD going oh here.
Speaker 1:This is what I think I got. These are my symptoms. Don't miss it. Click, click, click, click, click, click. Oh look, this is it. No, no, Go and have your test done. Go and get your test done With your doctor and have a discussion with your doctor Right and actually have a diagnosis Right.
Speaker 2:Because this is a big. Nobody understands how in the world the healing works in the pagan community. You have to work with your doctors, you have to work with your herbalist. You have to work with your doctors. You have to work with your herbalist. You have to work with your apothecaries.
Speaker 3:You have to work with all.
Speaker 2:You've got to get all these people to work together, Right? If you're going to somebody and you're doing a healing or something, you need to be aware of what in the world is actually going on. Absolutely. There are some other problems with healing. Now. I know a lot of healers like to use crystals and stuff to put the bad energy in. This becomes a problem too. All right, Because, again, most crystals act like regulators and will slowly leak out energy over time Again.
Speaker 2:that's the reason they're great for protection. But if you're putting something bad in there, you've got to put something good in there to hold it in place. You've got to put a guard on that.
Speaker 1:Well, and not only that, but if you're using that crystal to contain whatever bad energy you're quote-unquote healing from somebody, you need to cleanse that crystal every once in a while, bury it in the ground, let the ground soak it. Well, you need to get it away from you, no matter what.
Speaker 2:Because again this stuff sort of acts like radiation.
Speaker 1:Yes, it will leak out. It's like nuclear waste.
Speaker 2:It will leak out, it will affect you. Matter of fact, a lot of the healers I know over the years seem to be the most sickest people, more than anything else, and every time you walk into their house they're surrounded by all these crystals that they've got sickness in and they're sitting there in the middle of them.
Speaker 1:Yep Stewing in their own juices, so to speak. Right and no that's not good.
Speaker 2:No, I mean, if you're going to use this, yes, you need to put something in there to hold it in place and get it out of your house.
Speaker 1:Right, Get it out of your house. You need to periodic. Like I said before, if you're going to hang on to that crystal, then you need to cleanse it. You need to find something to do with that energy.
Speaker 2:Right. Regardless, however you handle it, it needs to be dealt with. I mean, lady Abba has a box that's had spells and stuff to trap everything inside the box that she puts inside the box. All right, it's kind of like a a safe a witch safe?
Speaker 1:yeah, I don't know how to explain it.
Speaker 2:But yes, that's it right. I mean we find a big cabinet or something and we scribe stuff all the way around it runes and other symbols, sigils.
Speaker 1:you know angelils, you know angelic symbols. Whatever you want to use, but you put some protection on there To try to hold things in.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely so. Again, here's one of the things I see a lot of healers do, that I don't want to disagree with them. I understand what they're doing, but I still think they need to put something in there Again. They themselves are too sick, and I think this is where the problem is Right Is that they use these stones to keep trap this stuff in there and then they hang on to them.
Speaker 1:What's that old saying? Physician, heal thyself. Come on, take care of yourself, baby, Take care of yourself.
Speaker 2:Please, I mean dipping into those energies and messing with them. You already got the stink on you. You just don't need to be sitting in it too, Right?
Speaker 1:There are residual effects absolutely and you need to be aware of that Now there's another part of healing that gets a little rougher.
Speaker 2:Do tell, because sometimes the only way to heal someone is to allow them to move on, sometimes reincarnate and stuff like that. So the healing no longer is a healing but more of a here, let me guide you over to the other side, you know, and that's can be a little daunting. Yeah, you know, I mean that procedure sitting bedside and trying to guide that person over is not a. It's not a fun thing no, it's not.
Speaker 2:Sometimes it's necessary and it can take you to some dark places for days afterwards when you yes, it can if you're not careful when paying attention. Absolutely so. I don't hear a lot of healers talk about that part. They seem to want to ignore the part that maybe reincarnation is the only solution.
Speaker 1:I think we don't talk about that because it's I think it's probably more of the taboo side of and taboo is not the right word, but it's part of the darker side of healing. And it's not something that people want to talk about.
Speaker 2:Well, I mean it's like hospice care.
Speaker 1:Yeah, hospice care is. It's a terrible thing.
Speaker 2:It's a terrible thing, but it's there, it's necessary. It's necessary and these nurses and stuff are doing everything they can to make everybody comfortable Right During this process.
Speaker 1:Because we know what's going on and, honestly, it takes a special person to be a hospice nurse. Yes, it does. I mean wow, because you're dealing with not only dealing with the patient, you're dealing with all the family members. Yeah, because the house is going to be full of family members. Yeah, and you're dealing with them and they've got questions. They're angry, they're sad, they're distraught.
Speaker 2:Oh, Lord, you know, mm-mm. So again, there is a part of healing where, even in the pagan traditions, we have a sort of hospice care mindset. Yes, that you know. We realize there are times we have to let nature take its course. Mm-hmm, you can't fight it anymore. I mean, it's true, but don't get me wrong.
Speaker 2:Now, like I think, reiki is a good thing, and especially when you're having chronic pain, okay, but I don't think Reiki will ever actually heal anything. I think to me and I could be wrong Reiki to me is more like just going to the doctor and getting flu or cold.
Speaker 1:You think it's more like a Band-Aid?
Speaker 2:I think it's more like a Band-Aid.
Speaker 1:It's not really going to do anything to help the situation, except maybe Relieve the pain for a little while, for a little while, yeah.
Speaker 2:Kind of like, oh God, the acupuncture, acupuncture, right. And again, just like you know, doing Tai Chi and yoga and stuff like that, as long as you're doing it it helps, right. But as soon as you stop doing it, so again, it's not necessarily a cure, right, it's you're managing, you're helping someone's, managing their pain.
Speaker 1:Right More than anything else, mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:So, which you know, you can also do that through meditation. You can up your pain tolerance, sure, yeah, which is possible. You know a lot of people in temples seems to do that automatically at some point for some reason. Right, it does happen For some reason, and it's always centered around meditation. As soon as your meditation starts to really take off, suddenly it's just like oh, I burnt myself. When did that happen, right? What else can we talk about?
Speaker 1:What else would you like to say about? Well, I know, uh, you and I have a little differing opinion about how healing works with the healer. You have the opinion that the energy that you're using doesn't replenish itself, that once it's used, it's used.
Speaker 2:No, not necessarily.
Speaker 1:I believe the energy we're using is our own life force, energy Right To heal someone else Right, and that once it's gone, you've actually, once it's used, you've actually taken time off of your lifestyle.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I believe every time you do that, when you're doing healings and you're really trying to use literally life force energy, my belief is that you're whacking off days and hours at the end of your life. You're just shorting it slightly to help somebody else.
Speaker 1:So you don't think it's by a whole lot, but you do think you are taking some time off.
Speaker 2:I believe it affects you. It depends on the sickness, how bad it is, how severe and how many people are helping you. Okay, but again, when you do those spells, I don't think there's any way to sit here and go. Okay, we're all going to take four hours of our life and put it. I don't. Yeah, you know what I'm saying? It's not quite that technical. Some people, I think, have a easier time transferring that life force energy, so they might accidentally give too much okay while other people might not give as much because they're not quite as talented in that.
Speaker 2:Alright, are you?
Speaker 3:with me.
Speaker 2:We're talking about like the difference between someone who naturally plays a piano and someone who's taught a piano Right. You know only really smart music. People can actually hear the difference sometimes. Sometimes, yeah, the way they do that, but there is a difference in the way you've learned and the way you I don't know how to explain that the easier talent person just seems to be able to do it easier, right? It's like they got an extra skill or something right.
Speaker 1:It's kind of like, um just uh, something that comes naturally right, just to some people and not others.
Speaker 2:I had no rhyme or reason. I've never figured that out but yeah, that's what I believe. You don't think that.
Speaker 1:No, I am of the opinion that our energy is constantly. It's like a circuit with the earth and with everything that's around us, right?
Speaker 2:So we are made of stardust.
Speaker 1:Scientifically, we are made of stardust, right. Scientifically, we are made of stardust, right. Which means we are part of the cosmos, which means we are tapped into an infinite source of energy, right, right. So that makes us part of that circuit. So I think that whatever, whatever we're throwing out gets recirculated. It may take a little longer to replenish, maybe. Whatever we're throwing out gets recirculated. It may take a little longer to replenish, maybe.
Speaker 3:But think of it kind of like let's take.
Speaker 1:RPGs right Games, right when you play an RPG, a role-playing game, most of the time magic casters have what's referred to as mana Right or mana, however's referred to as mana Right, right or mana, however you want to say it. You use it up, you sit down, you rest. It replenishes, right. That's kind of how I view it. Not quite, but that's kind of how I view it. It's just, it's something that recirculates. We are part of a giant circuit of energy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm not saying we're not, it's just for some reason. When it comes to healing, I think to help someone heal we have to give them over life force, actual life force, energy. I don't know how else to explain that. I get that You're trying to do something a little bit extra.
Speaker 1:This is not like me casting a spell to win the lotto or something no, I understand that, but I just I I can't, for, for whatever reason, I can't get on board with that because it's not how I view energy. Again, for me it's just, it's, it's something that we can do, right, because we are part of this greater force of creation.
Speaker 2:I understand that.
Speaker 1:You know, it's kind of like. It's kind of like in the Bible. Okay, we'll go back to Christianity, because I have my roots in Christianity. Right, right, Right In the Bible, jesus tells his disciples you too can go and do the same things that I have done. Yes, which includes healing people, raising the dead, healing the sick, you know whatever. Right? Yeah, if that's the case, how are we shortening our lifespan? I just I can't.
Speaker 2:I mean you. The sad part about this is it's never one way, to approve or not.
Speaker 1:No, there's not.
Speaker 2:We don't know how long. We know the average, but for one particular individual, me myself, nobody knows how long I'm supposed to live. What was my, what was my expiration date when I was born?
Speaker 1:no, nobody again, we can't prove it, we can't disprove it, just like you can't prove or disprove what I'm saying well of course I believe, but it just. It's an interesting argument when you sit down with people, because people have different views on it right.
Speaker 2:It's just, for some reason, when I think it comes to life force, energy and I'm going to put it to you this way we're mainly talking about healing other humans and stuff like that. Even if it was your dog and you're doing this, I still think you're giving up something, a little bit of your life. Okay, all right. And again, I'm not sitting here saying that you're taking years off out of whack or anything like that, right?
Speaker 2:no, it's just, you are taking some fraction of time Some time away from yourself, however big or small it might be, you know, and no, I'm not sure that energy might sort of replenishes itself. There might be a little bounce. You might not use it all up, but hey, you know what. You used two hours, but hey, guess what. We're going to give you an hour back. There might be a cash back program.
Speaker 1:Who's to say? It's like the discover of healing Cash back. We'll match it at the end of the year.
Speaker 2:I mean, healing is a very big part of a lot of the spells and stuff we hear. It is for a lot of people, yeah Right, I mean from getting pregnant to easy childbirth to not getting pregnant. These are all healing spells technically, technically yes, because we're messing with our biologies.
Speaker 1:We're trying to ease pain, we're trying to make things more bearable, right?
Speaker 2:but yeah, yeah, so yeah, I can see that they're all forms of healing now, I think it takes a certain mindset to be one of these people which I, I will sit here and I am not one of those people I am not either.
Speaker 1:I think I can be if I need to be, but I've got to be in a specific situation for that.
Speaker 2:I tend to see more women do this than men. Priestesses seem to be better at this versus priests.
Speaker 1:It's that mother nature, it is.
Speaker 2:It's the whole entire thing. You and the family are out in the woods. A bear comes out. Everybody jumps behind dad.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:But the kids go outside, scrape their knees. They're running to mom first.
Speaker 1:Exactly, I mean it's nurture. It's what women are good at.
Speaker 2:You know, I'm not sitting here saying men can't do this.
Speaker 1:No, absolutely not. I just tend to think women tend to be better at it yes than we are.
Speaker 2:I'm not saying we can't do it, it's just I don't know, I can't explain that it's um, it's kind of like it's kind of my mindset about women being nurses. They're better, they're better at it than guy nurses. Like I see the use of guy nurses. Women tend to be better at that position.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it's more of again, I think it's more of. Women have that natural affinity towards nurturing and caring. Yeah, and I think that's what makes them better at it's because they're more in tune with it they it's just again, it comes natural to them and I think that makes them natural healers
Speaker 2:right, like I said, I don't. I think guys can do it.
Speaker 1:I just don't think we're as good at it, as women tend to be right that's all. Yeah, it's kind of like we might struggle a little bit to get it done, but you know, hey, hey.
Speaker 2:You know, it might take us a little bit longer.
Speaker 1:It happens.
Speaker 2:Right, anything else.
Speaker 1:No, I think that about covers it.
Speaker 2:Let's go get some coffee.
Speaker 1:Let's get some coffee. Thanks for listening. Join us next week for another episode. Pagan Coffee Talk is brought to you by Life Temple and Seminary. Please visit us at lifetempleseminaryorg for more information, as well as links to our social media Facebook, discord, twitter, youtube and Reddit.
Speaker 3:We travel down this trodden path, the maze of stone and mire. Just hold my hand as we pass by a sea of blazing pyres. And so it is the end of our day, so walk with me till morning breaks. And so it is the end of our day. So walk with me till morning.
